Border crossing to Cambodia and Vietnam

khieawrider650

New member
Joined
Oct 17, 2024
Location
Thailand, Indonesia
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Bajaj Pulsar 220, Yamaha Nmax 155, Kawasaki Versys 650
Greetings everyone. It's an honor to join this community.

I'm an Indonesian working in Thailand. Just bought a Versys 650 and planning to do ASEAN border crossing and my first destination in mind is Cambodia and Vietnam, with the route starts from Bangkok to Trat, Trat to Phnom Penh, and Phnom Penh to Ho Chi Minh City. There are a few questions I would like to ask.

1. I never seen any thread discussing about Khlong Yai - Cham Yeam Border. Is it hard to go pass that border?
2. I want to ask regarding the driving license since I heard that Indonesian driving license is valid in all ASEAN countries, even Cambodia was the first coutries that recognizes it. Do I still have to register an IDP to cross?
3. If IDP is required, I am taking care of driving license transfer from Indonesian to Thai. For the IDP, should I register for Indonesian IDP or Thai IDP?
4. Is it true that if we want to cross Vietnam we should go with a travel agency?

Sorry for long post and thank you.
 
Welcome to the forum
I believe your Indonesian licence is valid in all ASEAN countries, my Malaysian friend has ridden all over Thailand and other SE Asia countries using his with no IDP

I think you may struggle getting a big bike into Vietnam and if I am not mistaken you will also have to go through an agency/tour operator to get travel permits and maybe even a guide

Wayne
 
Welcome to the forum
I believe your Indonesian licence is valid in all ASEAN countries, my Malaysian friend has ridden all over Thailand and other SE Asia countries using his with no IDP

I think you may struggle getting a big bike into Vietnam and if I am not mistaken you will also have to go through an agency/tour operator to get travel permits and maybe even a guide

Wayne
Thank you for the answer. Really nice to know that ASEAN countries driving license do valid in each other.

Do you know any tour agency that I can contact?
 
Greetings everyone. It's an honor to join this community.

I'm an Indonesian working in Thailand. Just bought a Versys 650 and planning to do ASEAN border crossing and my first destination in mind is Cambodia and Vietnam, with the route starts from Bangkok to Trat, Trat to Phnom Penh, and Phnom Penh to Ho Chi Minh City. There are a few questions I would like to ask.

1. I never seen any thread discussing about Khlong Yai - Cham Yeam Border. Is it hard to go pass that border?
2. I want to ask regarding the driving license since I heard that Indonesian driving license is valid in all ASEAN countries, even Cambodia was the first coutries that recognizes it. Do I still have to register an IDP to cross?
3. If IDP is required, I am taking care of driving license transfer from Indonesian to Thai. For the IDP, should I register for Indonesian IDP or Thai IDP?
4. Is it true that if we want to cross Vietnam we should go with a travel agency?

Sorry for long post and thank you.

A Thai car crossing into Cambodia from Thailand or from Laos is straightforward these days. A motorcycle on the other hand is not always guaranteed, but should, in theory, be permitted to cross into Cambodia via Hat Lek/Koh Kong.

Register on the Cambodian customs app and purchase cross-border insurance (soon to be mandatory) and you should be OK. Cambodian customs is in a hut right there on the right, just after the barrier. They've mellowed considerably since Cambodia finally introduced a proper customs system and was ordered by the government to allow vehicles in without the silly restrictions they used have, prior to Covid. That being said, coming from Laos, motorcycles seem to be a bit of a no-no in both directions now. Vietnamese motorcycles are definitely out, but I don't like the chances of Thai motorcycles being able to cross unaided either. You haven't mentioned going to Laos but just wanted to give you a heads up.

Getting into Vietnam requires a tour; they're very strict and officials are aggressive and unfriendly. Don't even attempt it without one, you'll probably be denied exit by Cambodia anyway, but even if you asked Vietnamese officials for permission, it would be a firm NO without a tour.

If you're working in Thailand, you should get a Thai license. An Indonesian license is good for up to 90 days, but you're supposed to apply for a Thai license upon taking up residence in the Kingdom.

In theory, an Indonesian, like a Thai license, is accepted in Cambodia and all ASEAN countries, without the need for an IDP. In practice, corrupt Phnom Penh police will ask for a bribe if you don't have an IDP accompanying it or a Cambodian license.

For Vietnam, they're even less likely to accept any foreign license. I've been threatened by the Vietnamese police for showing a Thai DL after being caught speeding. They said they'd impound the vehicle (a car) and charge me 21 million Dong. In the end, I got off for 1.3 million Dong after 45 minutes of heated negotiations with my Vietnamese friend present and a senior officer overruling the junior one, who wanted to throw the book at me for what is a minor "offense" in any other regional country.

BTW I recently drove (in my Thai car) from Bangkok to Vientiane-Pakse-Phnom Penh-Bavet (Vietnamese border)-Phnom Penh-Koh Kong-Trat-Bangkok. It was smooth as silk BUT of course, I didn't try to cross into Vietnam with my vehicle as I knew that wouldn't be permitted. Even Cambodian vehicles can't cross (with the exception of cross-border buses of course), except with some special paperwork and then they're not going any further than 15km from the border. Therefore, I parked at a casino (which is kinda dodgy, although like last time I did this, I paid a guard. On returning to my car, some tuk-tuk driver shakes his head at me, so I give a different guard an extra dollar, after which I receive a gleaming smile from the tuk-tuk driver). I had been in Ho Chi Minh for 4 days.
 
Just on the IDP matter; I don't think you can apply for an IDP on the basis of your Indonesian license without returning to Indonesia. Obviously, you would need to apply for one on your Thai license. It costs 505 Baht and the usual docs must accompany it BUT in theory, you need a 5-year Thai license. Therefore, apply for a 2-year Thai license now (they won't give you a 5-year one until you've first held a 2-year one) and see if they'll issue a 1-year IDP on that.

I'd still get an IDP for Cambodia if possible, though all police officers outside of Phnom Penh (even on the outskirts of the city) have been fine with my Thai driver's license.

However, if the answer is no, then just use your Indonesian license for now, which seems to be fine in most cases. How long is it valid for?

BTW, in Phnom Penh, you can avoid the police if you don't drive down Monivong or Norodom boulevards or don't use these boulevards until after around 8pm. To cross over the Mekong towards Bavet, use Koh Pich. No police there, not to mention it's faster, shorter and has less traffic.
 
Just on the IDP matter; I don't think you can apply for an IDP on the basis of your Indonesian license without returning to Indonesia. Obviously, you would need to apply for one on your Thai license. It costs 505 Baht and the usual docs must accompany it BUT in theory, you need a 5-year Thai license. Therefore, apply for a 2-year Thai license now (they won't give you a 5-year one until you've first held a 2-year one) and see if they'll issue a 1-year IDP on that.

I'd still get an IDP for Cambodia if possible, though all police officers outside of Phnom Penh (even on the outskirts of the city) have been fine with my Thai driver's license.

However, if the answer is no, then just use your Indonesian license for now, which seems to be fine in most cases. How long is it valid for?

BTW, in Phnom Penh, you can avoid the police if you don't drive down Monivong or Norodom boulevards or don't use these boulevards until after around 8pm. To cross over the Mekong towards Bavet, use Koh Pich. No police there, not to mention it's faster, shorter and has less traffic.
Thank your the THOROUGH and helpful advice.

I just got my temporary Thai Driving License valid for 2 years, but as far as I understand, I cannot apply for Thai IDP before I finish the 2 years, and make the 5 year Thai DL. And I am planning to make an Indo IDP anyway.

My Indo IDP valid until next year. I'm planning to cross the border this Dec 7, wish me luck. If it is rejected, then I'll be just fine hahaha. I'd stay in Trat.

Anyway, where can I get TM2 and when should I do the registration in Cambodian website?
 
Regarding the IDP - I think you're right. I have not attempted to get one on a 2-year Thai license; I've only ever had one on the basis of my 5-year license. I'll be renewing my IDPs at the same time as I renew my 5-year licenses, which will be soon.

The TM2/TM3/TM4 forms can be downloaded off any of the Thai immigration websites, which have them. You need to do a search in Thai. Otherwise, it's available at the border, but then you waste about 15-20 minutes filling it out, whereas if you do it in advance you can save time.

The registration in the Cambodian customs website/app needs to be done.

I assume you've already been to Cambodia, seeing that my reply comes several weeks after your intended entry date?
 
Regarding the IDP - I think you're right. I have not attempted to get one on a 2-year Thai license; I've only ever had one on the basis of my 5-year license. I'll be renewing my IDPs at the same time as I renew my 5-year licenses, which will be soon.

The TM2/TM3/TM4 forms can be downloaded off any of the Thai immigration websites, which have them. You need to do a search in Thai. Otherwise, it's available at the border, but then you waste about 15-20 minutes filling it out, whereas if you do it in advance you can save time.

The registration in the Cambodian customs website/app needs to be done.

I assume you've already been to Cambodia, seeing that my reply comes several weeks after your intended entry date?
Yeah. It didn't go well.

Me and my passport were rejected. Why? I don't know, but I have speculations.

Fortunately the guy whose helping me speaks Malay (Malay tribe-Cambodian), after took a pic of my passport the Cambo side decided to reject my passport. I even ask "how much do I have to pay?" to them as a lot of stories of giving tea money right? But he said it's not the case, it was ME and MY PASSPORT. Malay and Indo cannot enter Cambo and nobody on site knows why.

My speculations is Indo and Cambo is not in a good relationship due to human t**ficking related gambling and casinos in Thai-Cambo borders and the rejection is already happening for quite some time for Indonesians.
 
Yeah. It didn't go well.

Me and my passport were rejected. Why? I don't know, but I have speculations.

Fortunately the guy whose helping me speaks Malay (Malay tribe-Cambodian), after took a pic of my passport the Cambo side decided to reject my passport. I even ask "how much do I have to pay?" to them as a lot of stories of giving tea money right? But he said it's not the case, it was ME and MY PASSPORT. Malay and Indo cannot enter Cambo and nobody on site knows why.

My speculations is Indo and Cambo is not in a good relationship due to human t**ficking related gambling and casinos in Thai-Cambo borders and the rejection is already happening for quite some time for Indonesians.
Wow. I didn't expect this to happen to you.

I guess it's not only Thailand that has a reputation for refusing entry at the land borders (especially at the notorious Aranyaprathet border crossing next to Poipet) but Cambodia does too, if you're of the "wrong" nationality.

I have been aware of the large number of Indonesians involved in the casino and scam industry in Cambodia for some years now. Has always struck me as odd; of all nationalities, why are Indonesians there? In recent years, one hears more and more about Thai nationals as well, often using Cambodia as a base to scam their own citizens, but Chinese and Indonesian nationals are overrepresented, with sizeable numbers of Vietnamese as well. Chinese don't seem to face any issues crossing in/out of Cambodia by land from Thailand or Vietnam, unless they happen to have an unsavory immigration history that the country they're crossing into picks up on. A genuine Chinese tourist won't be rejected though.

Anyway, sad to hear that you, as an innocent traveler, were caught up in this mess. I guess you either have to cross into Laos (and Laos to Cambodia directly) or fly into the country.

Another option might be to try a smaller border crossing such as O'Smach or Chong Sa-ngam. They're much friendlier. While Hat Lek-Koh Kong is quite friendly and straightforward, especially on the Thai side, Cambodian officials are a little more uptight there. Although they're a lot more relaxed than they used to be, when I departed from there last month back into Thailand (with my car) the immigration guy stamping me out kept telling me not to peek inside the cubicle, which I found strange. He told me 3 times. Like, dude, what's your problem?

Absolutely zero issues with customs or Thai immigration, which was professional, though not chatty, as is typical for that border. Unless you ask them a question, they're not going to engage in a conversation with you, unlike at some of the quieter border crossings.

For Malays, there is no issue entering Cambodia (or shouldn't be, anyway) - I saw 2 Malaysian motorcyclists re-enter Thailand through the Ban Khao Din border crossing the first time I passed through there in July. I was exiting Thailand (by car), they were re-entering. The weirdest part is how every time I cross the border that way (have exited there twice and re-entered once), never using that border in both directions on the same trip, I keep getting told to ask the other side if my vehicle can pass through. The first time I did that, I went to the other side to check. The guy filled out the form, then I went back to the Thai side to get my outbound customs form. There was an issue, because apparently, I didn't return the form to the correct window on my last re-entry to Thailand through a different Cambodian border, but once I drove down there to sort it out, I was able to get processed out.

On my subsequent trip, I told the official on duty on the Thai side of course I can pass through, following him querying me as to whether I have asked the Cambodian side for permission; I made a successful crossing just over a month earlier. The printer had problems (seems like they get so few vehicles passing that way they rarely use the printer) but after 20 minutes of waiting and me offering to troubleshoot, in the end, the printer finally spat out the form and I was through. Each time I go to Ban Khao Din, there's always a different customs official (or sometimes 2 or 3) on duty, whereas on the Cambodian side, it's always the same guy. As a result, I usually have to explain things to the Thai officials I encounter as if I had never been there before or they were new to the job.

On my first re-entry that way just recently in fact, Thai customs wanted to send me back through Aranyaprathet because on the form it said i would re-enter that way, but I explained that has never been an issue and I usually re-enter through a different border despite what it says on the customs form and have never had any problems. After nearly half an hour of him going back and forth over the phone with Aranyaprathet, he changed the entry in his system and I was through. I also reminded him about the Malay motorcycles from back in July. I told him that a Thai vehicle has an automatic right to re-entry and they allowed Malaysian bikes to enter, so of course my vehicle needs to be allowed back in. Otherwise, they need to explain to me how they permitted entry to Malaysian bikes at a border that is so unknown, even Thais don't use it and customs officials on both sides don't even know the other sides' entry rules.

Speaking of Koh Kong, before Covid, Malaysian vehicles were regularly refused entry there, because they used to have a Koh Kong province restriction. This has since been removed, but it could be that some borders still refuse them (Malaysian vehicles; not Malaysian citizens who cross on foot, in a Thai or Cambodian vehicle or by bus). Thai vehicles on the other hand can enter and exit through any Thai-Cambodian crossing and I was also successful in crossing the Lao-Cambodian border from Laos to Cambodia as well. I've now crossed every Thai-Cambodian international border, all 7 of them with my vehicle, either in one direction or both, depending on the border.

There are also rumors that some Thai-Cambodian borders don't allow Thai vehicles registered in the names of Cambodian citizens to pass into Cambodia; this applies in particular, to Ban Laem and Ban Pakkard. Cambodians can bring their Cambodian registered vehicles into Thailand through these checkpoints, though in practice, it's very rare to see one go beyond the border market. You mostly see Thai vehicles head into Cambodia through those two checkpoints, despite needing a "bai wo" or military document to pass through (easy and free to apply for, but a waste of time as the military post is 30km from the Ban Pakkard border crossing).
 
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Thus, to summarize, I think it's worth noting that these "unwritten rules" pertaining to nationals of certain countries, particularly some of the ASEAN states may be in effect at some border crossings with entry or exit blocked or requiring additional documentation, depending on the direction you're traveling in.

Already years ago, Vietnamese nationals crossing into Thailand by land from Cambodia, particularly through borders such as Ban Pakkard and Aranyaprathet, were heavily scrutinized by Thai immigration. If they had sufficient funds in cash, hotel bookings and flight tickets out, they were granted entry, but if they presented their passports only, there's a good chance they would have been denied entry.

Another border where this applies (although not relevant right now as all foreigners are currently blocked there) is Mae Sot. The Thai side won't allow Vietnamese nationals to cross over, unless they hold a multiple entry visa for Thailand or a visa for Myanmar. Although Myanmar would offer a day pass upon payment of a 500 Baht or USD 10 fee, the Thai side won't allow Vietnamese to pass through, except with a visa. If they come back into Thailand that way, having spent some time traveling in Myanmar on a visa, that would be allowed. However, border runs, whereby you cross into Myanmar on a day pass, is only permitted for westerners, Japanese, Singaporeans, Malaysians and citizens of other wealthy nations.

Entries into Thailand from Laos tend to be straightforward for Vietnamese nationals, unless they have spent an excessive time in Thailand on visa-exempt status. The same is true in the reverse direction.

I have personal experience with this, as I have traveled across many borders with a Vietnamese friend. Have traveled through the Thai-Lao, Thai-Cambodian, Vietnam-Cambodia and Thai-Myanmar crossings with him.
 
I'd like to add to this topic a little and update what I wrote earlier.

I can now confirm that Chong Chom, when entering Thailand is NOT a good border to use. This crossing is basically a temporary border, with all the offices housed in temporary buildings, the type used on construction sites. That's probably the first indication that things are not going to be standard there. While it may have been a good border to use to exit Thailand for Cambodia in the past (pre-Covid), there is no longer any good reason to use it, given Cambodia is now allowing vehicles to enter through any border and in fact, Poipet is one of the best and most straightforward places to enter now. As a large border, Aranyaprathet/Poipet operates on professional and standardized protocols. They don't come up with different rules every other day. The same is true of the second busiest Thailand-Cambodia border crossing, which is Hat Lek-Koh Kong. Always straightforward there.

Citizens of certain Asian countries such as Chinese and Vietnamese, will be heavily scrutinized by Thai immigration at this border [Chong Chom]. First, they'll be taken into an interrogation room and a "human trafficking" form will be filled out by an immigration officer, while the traveler is interviewed. This process could take anywhere from a few minutes to hours (as recently documented by a Vietnamese electric vehicle caravan tour, which took 10 hours to cross the border here). The same is true at other small borders - if you're from Indonesia, Vietnam, China and certain other Asian countries, don't use Chong Chom, Ban Laem, Ban Pakkard or Ban Khao Din for entry into Thailand.

Secondly, there is a customs official on duty at this border, possibly the head of customs, who will make your life difficult if you're attempting to bring your Thai registered vehicle back in, after having exited Thailand via a different border. The old rules requiring vehicles to exit at the same border they entered, are no longer enforced by Cambodia, since they've introduced the new customs app. Thailand no longer enforces this rule on Thai vehicles either (well, they never really did in my experience) as the limiting factor was always Cambodian customs, at least prior to Covid. It is absurd that this officer is claiming that vehicles must re-enter at the same border as they exited at (although apparently Thai customs does impose this restriction on Cambodian vehicles entering Thailand). My form even had Chong Chom written as the re-entry point but the officer said that "didn't matter".

I went back and forth with this clueless officer for 15 minutes before he finally gave up and of course my vehicle was allowed back in (there's no way I would have gone back to Cambodia). I think this is simply a personal power trip opportunity for this officer but in the end, he lost. I was starting to get flustered because it appeared to me that Thai customs is prioritizing foreign vehicles over Thai ones. I asked him why aren't all borders enforcing the requirement for foreign vehicles from third countries, which don't have an agreement with Thailand, to have a permit and guide? This is the rule. He even brought out the "Foreign Vehicle Entry Permit" sheet, indicating this border knows about the requirement. I do recall asking customs here, pre-Covid but after the new rules went into effect about this and the officer on duty at the time told me "Chinese vehicles absolutely need to come on a tour, but others don't". In other words, this border was breaking the rules imposed by the land transport department. While they rightfully enforced the rule for Chinese and also Vietnamese registrations, technically, these rules apply to all foreign vehicles, so should be applied in all cases.

I've even heard of vehicles registered in Europe and such places being granted entry into Thailand without a permit down south and then facing difficulties exiting Thailand for Laos or Cambodia due to lacking such a permit. All because an officer at one border doesn't do their job properly by enforcing the law that all of them are supposed to obey.

On the other hand, a Thai vehicle, just like a Thai passport holder, has automatic right of re-entry into the Kingdom of Thailand, regardless of what border crossing is used, as long as they pass immigration and customs. There should never be any question about this. Enforce the law on foreign vehicles correctly (which I am a full supporter of, given that Thai vehicles can't enter Vietnam or China without a tour...the occasional exception being motorcycles entering Vietnam via certain borders sometimes make it without a tour).

Obviously, as the owner of a Thai vehicle and resident of the country with a Thai family, I think like a Thai and demand reciprocity. Of course, I'm not really upset at European overlanders as they're not the ones who prompted the change in these rules, first imposed in 2016. That was the Chinese and thankfully, ever since June 27, 2016, they've been required to apply for a permit to enter Thailand with their vehicles.

With Cambodia employing a new customs app / website since 2022, allowing users to create a login / password and upload their vehicle and personal details and make changes such as exit border details or extensions of stay and updating your vehicle registration / passport details, it's now as easy to enter Cambodia as it is to enter Malaysia or Laos (although for motorcycle riders, Laos remains a bit of a muddle, due to the fact that only cars are covered by the official Thai-Lao cross border agreement).

Anyway, it's Thailand which is making life difficult for travelers from certain Asian countries entering the country and while the customs incident was probably a one off (other borders may be a pain in their own way, but there has never been a question about re-entering Thailand with a Thai vehicle after having exited at another border), it certainly made me question passing through small borders.

Still, given my experience, I'd suggest the following to make your life smoother when traveling by car or motorcycle to Cambodia, especially with a Thai registered vehicle.

Avoid Ban Laem and Ban Pakkard for exiting the country, due to the silly requirement to get a "bai wo" document from the military, 30km west of the Ban Pakkard border. Given you can cross at the remote Ban Khao Din border 64km north of Ban Laem (or 86km north of Ban Pakkard) without one, it's pointless to go through this nonsensical and time-wasting procedure. You might as well just exit at Aranyaprathet/Poipet or Ban Khao Din, regardless of whether you're coming from Bangkok, Pattaya or Chanthaburi. If you're in Chanthaburi, consider either Ban Khao Din or going to Hat Lek.

Avoid Ban Laem for re-entry, since officials there have no experience dealing with private vehicles entering the country. Yes, you can enter with your car or motorcycle (as long as it's Thai or Cambodian registered) but you'll be pushed back and forth between different desks and despite not having anyone else in the queue, officials may take 45 minutes to process you, whereas at other larger, more professional border crossings, it will take just 2 minutes!

Ban Pakkard is OK for re-entry, but despite it's small size, can be overwhelmed by migrant workers at certain times of day. You're better off at Hat Lek or Aranyaprathet, which, despite their higher traveler volumes, will process you faster as they're large and professional border crossings. Aranyaprathet has special outside counters for vehicle drivers, so you don't have to deal with the notorious upstairs immigration officers. On the Cambodian side though, everyone has to queue up in the foreigner's hall, even drivers of vehicles.

Chong Sa-ngam was a breeze both times I passed through, despite being a remote border. At least it's a permanent border, unlike Chong Chom, which is temporary.

The best borders to use remain Aranyaprathet/Poipet and Hat Lek/Koh Kong if you're driving a vehicle and also if you're a citizen of certain Asian countries (exceptions being residents of Thailand, which should, in theory, be treated the same as any other expat regardless of the border they use for entry).
 
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