What sort of helmet cam are people using?

[Lightemup]

As the urge in me to get a new gadget grows bigger after seeing Max's vids, I thought I'd ask here who uses what camera and the pro' and con's of each one.
I know that there are tons of forums that deal with this on the web, but as I'm planning on using it here under these conditions you guys are using them, I thought this might be as good a place as any other.
I've used a helmet cam/ remote cam thingie myself, but thats going back to 2005 technology and running them in Iraq for shooting people stuff and we've come along way since.

As I see it there are basically two top contenders:
GoPro Hero HD
And ContourHD or whatever their top model is called at the moment.

Any input on them would be appreciated.

Max what are you using?

 

[MastaMax]

Hi there,

I choose the contourHD for following reasons:

- Default mount is on the side of the helmet, not on top. With all the downed trees here I can't even count how many times I hit the top of my helmet against trees.
- It doesn't have to be in a waterproof case, the unit is much more resistant (hard aluminum case), which means you get much better sound.
- the look... personal opinion the contourHD looks much better
- much more mounting possibilities, it goes very far (example: http://contour.com/products/picatinny-mount)
- found very cheap bundles on ebay (they might have the same for the goPro, didn't check). I bought the camera with 2 batteries, waterproof case, extra lenses and goggle mount for very cheap.
- ability to record 60fps vs 50fps for the goPro. If I want to do slow-motion I want max fps.

Now about image quality it's about the same... GoPro has a wider angle, but I don't really care as often I would even reduce it afterwards by adding a negative effect to remove the fisheye look.

It's a endless debate which one is better, just pick the one you think looks the best

 

[LivinLOS]

If I was spending good money I would get the contour HD with the GPS functions..

I think the GoPro has a better user community and ideas (using 2 GoPros, a special housing and some software for dirt cheap 1080p 3d is genius) but the form factor is less useful for riders / helmet cams.

I also get tempted at totally the other end, for getting some of those Chinese MD80s super cheap (like 15 bucks each cheap).. super small.. And borderline disposable (which you will probably have to do as its chinese) what I like it you can cheaply have one cam forward, one cam back, one cam on an ankle mount and one on a moving helmet mount.. And edit between them, or have multi views in a frame and get creative.

Plus the 'not caring about it' aspect appeals. Its weak battery life would probably be its biggest worry.

 

[KTMphil]

If I was spending good money I would get the contour HD with the GPS functions..

I agree - hopefully it last you a few years, this seems to be an amazing device for the money

USD$ 329 on Amazon.com


http://www.amazon.com/ContourHD-720p-HD ... 737&sr=8-5

 

[MastaMax]

ContourHD is far from expensive... 139 USD new on ebay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ContourHD-1080P ... 818wt_1139

 

[Lightemup]

I Think Im gonna grab a GoPro thingie in Panthip Plaza and check it out.
The footage looks great on the site.

 

[KTMphil]

I've seen many of the GoPro's outer casings steam up due to humidity and temperature, making them useless at that time, which puts me off them & want to go for the Contour HD.

I Think Im gonna grab a GoPro thingie in Panthip Plaza and check it out.
The footage looks great on the site.

 

[LivinLOS]

ContourHD is far from expensive... 139 USD new on ebay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ContourHD-1080P ... 818wt_1139

WOW they re loads cheaper than I thought.. Had in my head they were in the 250 - 300 range.

I can see one of those in my future.

 

[Midnitemapper]

Drift Hd 170, just released...

http://driftinnovation.com/drift-hd-action-camera/
I am a Go Pro lover, however I would like to try this model with remote activated switch! and 9 megapixel camera!


Radio operated remote control

 

[Midnitemapper]

Go Pro, fogging tip

When you load the GP PRO camera in the very humid environment. 'The heat the camera generates will cause condensation inside the case. I alleviate this problem by using the supplied open back, the open back also allows better audio recording.

 

[MastaMax]

there are actually a lot of them, check out:
http://helmetcameracentral.com/
For reviews of all those cams. I think the first question you have to ask yourself is in what condition you are going to use the camera.

 

[SimonB]

I have used both; I have a ContourHD Pro and have borrowed a GoPro. The profile of the Contour is better suited to riding a bike on the highway, but the sound is better on the GoPro. I get nothing but wind noise above 50 kmh on the ContourHD.

picture quaility - hard for me to tell the difference, both are great.

I might do one of the modifications suggested on the ContourHD community site and wire a jack for external mic so I don't have to add music to drown out wind noise. You can see samples on YouTube - channel name sgpsimonb. DoD 2011 vids shot on GoPro, all the rest on Contour.

Ride safe.

 

[brian_bkk]

Go Pro, fogging tip

When you load the GP PRO camera in the very humid environment. 'The heat the camera generates will cause condensation inside the case. I alleviate this problem by using the supplied open back, the open back also allows better audio recording.

[attachment=0:1rhvubes]go-pro-back.jpg[/attachment:1rhvubes]

I had this problem a few times especially when going up or down mountains.. The altitude makes it fog up.
There are some inserts you can buy to stop this.. I have some ordered and on the way from the US.

Also another option as mentioned above is to use the open back.. To stop any fine dust getting in I usually place a thin layer or two of tissue between the open back of the case and camera then close it... Still allows the air in..

There are plenty of mounting positions for the Go Pro.. On top of the helmet or at the side, on the bike at the front of back, chest harness what ever you like.. When riding the trails I will use the side of the helmet position, when on the mountain ridges and wanting to show the view change to the top of the helmet.

You can also buy replaceable cover lense and the LCD viewer.. Should be already built in like the other model show above.

The fogging thing is the most annoying.. Think and hope I have that solved now.. otherwise very happy with the quality of the Go Pro.. When watching the trails on the Plasma TV I feel like I am playing a game on the PS3 in HD :-)

Cheers
Brian

 

[MastaMax]

2 new cameras are out, 1 Vholdr (contourHD) and 1 goPro:

Both look pretty sweet!

Highlights of both (personal opinion):

- GoPro can record WVGA: 848×480 at 120FPS! That means real super slow motion capability!
- GoPro has a 11MP camera, good for still pictures. Even has a Time-Lapse mode!
http://gopro.com/cameras/hd-hero2-motorsports-edition/

- Contour+ (new name) has a lot of new features, but nothing that strikes me (except the nice 2.8" aperture and the external microphone plug). Other stuff that might be appealing to others, like live streaming, bluetooth transfer... It has a GPS so you can follow your video on google maps in real time.
http://contour.com/products/contour-plus

Both have 170 degrees wide lens now (I think the 135 is wide enough, with 170 the fisheye effect will be too strong).

 

[KTMphil]

Im getting this new Contour headcam -- looks perfect

 

[Tom]

I might do one of the modifications suggested on the ContourHD community site and wire a jack for external mic so I don't have to add music to drown out wind noise.

Simon, did you ever get this to work? I have a ContourGPS, and the audio is absolutely atrocious above 40 km/h. I did try and steal one of my wife's fluffy hairbands and put it over the microphone as a sort of improvised 'dead cat'. That extended the usable range to about 60 km/h, but that's as fast as I can go without getting anything other than a loud 'whoooosssh'.

For anyone else considering the Contour-cameras, please note that at least some of the models have a fair bit of rolling shutter effect (aka the Jello effect). Whether they have improved on that with the new model I don't know, but at least on the ContourGPS it's quite noticable when things get bumpy. All cameras with a rolling shutter, which means most CMOS-cameras, have this to some extent, though some are better than others (the vio-pov.hd is supposedly the best one in this regard, though pricey).

 

[MastaMax]

Tom,
For the noise, put it in the waterproof case and you get the same results as with the goPro. Also new model has a built in jack for ext. microphone (not sure, to verify).
For the rolling shutter problem, record in 60fps. I've never noticed this effect on my videos, maybe it's a problem with your cam? Or maybe it's because you are going fast and I don't (only use it offroad so never > 100 km/h).

 

[Tom]

Tom,
For the noise, put it in the waterproof case and you get the same results as with the goPro. Also new model has a built in jack for ext. microphone (not sure, to verify).
For the rolling shutter problem, record in 60fps. I've never noticed this effect on my videos, maybe it's a problem with your cam? Or maybe it's because you are going fast and I don't (only use it offroad so never > 100 km/h).

A waterproof housing would not work very well in my case, as I mount it on the side of my helmet. As far as the rolling shutter goes, I have seen it on some of my footage where I'm not going particularly fast either (maybe 40 km/h). If I turn my head in a bumpy section, it really throws it off. If I'm going straight, or if I'm riding smoothly on a proper road, I hardly notice it at all. The 60 fps option is only available in 720p and I prefer to do my stuff in 1080p, where the maximum is 30 fps. I'll have to do some more experimenting to come up with a good solution for this. There is software available that can reduce this effect, which may be worth a try.
I believe you are correct about the new model having a jack for an external mic. However, I only just recently forked over 300 USD for the camera I have, so I don't really want to go and pay even more for another camera that's not all that different from what I've got. I think I'll do the external mic modification to it and then hold on to my cash until someone releases a full HD helmet cam with a global shutter, as opposed to a rolling one (actually the vio-pov 1.5 had this, put it was only 720p. Their new 1080p model went back to rolling shutter, go figure).

 

[KTMphil]

I'm about to pull the trigger on one of these - I think I'm going to go with the Drift HD. I had a play with Danny's the other night & on the newer Drift models the lens in replaceable.

 

[Tom]

Just noticed this in a local BigCamera shop. Another locally available option.

 

[KTMphil]

Looks like a good buy Tom, the drift has an excellent wide angle

Just noticed this in a local BigCamera shop. Another locally available option.
[attachment=0:7w0etg48]Drift Stealth.jpg[/attachment:7w0etg48]

 

[bigntall]

I rode with the GoPro in Laos and the most frustrating thing about the camera was the button to activate recording is tiny and you're never quite sure if its on or not. A major downside to the camera to offset the upside of fantastic community support and tons of mountd and accesories. I lost so much video because it was turned off instead of recording :cry . All the fun singletrack we did and I got nadda. Thats where the Contour excels as they have a nice toggle switch that is easy to distinguish between off and on by feel alone.

The concern I have with the Contour is mounting. I sweat like Elton John at a Boy Scout gathering so ride without goggles most of the time. Therefore the goggle mount that I see most people using would not function with me as I use a Quick Strap goggle mount system on my helmet.

The Quick Strap sytem would hinder mounts in the goggle strap region. Is anyone using the Contour mounted to the side of the chinbar?

I was also not impressed by the windnoise recorded by the Contour. Hideous.

Also curious if the GPS function on the new Contour will eat up battery life a lot quicker than the standard Contour?

 

[KTMphil]

I've just ordered the Drift HD

The new compact, durable, easy-to-use Drift HD camera elevates the point of view camera market to a higher level with the most feature-rich, multi-functional, professional helmet camera available to date:

Full HD for creating crystal clear footage
More compact housing, 4.1 inches and 4.23 oz., 25 percent smaller that its predecessor
Replaceable lens
Second rear cover to protect the camera when using an external mic or a USB charger
A playback LCD screen for lining up shots and the ability to play back the footage right away
Micro HDMI connector for HDTV playback
A remote control to enable you to film what you want to record, not the boring stuff in between
New goggle strap in addition to curved and flat adhesive mounts, paired with a universal clip for multiple mounting options
Standard 1/4? 20 thread for use with most tripods

If that isn?t enough the camera also has the following :

A rotating lens so you can mount the camera at any angle and any position to get that shot you are looking for
It can take 9 MP photos. Put it in the photo burst mode and you can take pictures every few seconds for as long as your memory card and battery lasts
You can pair the remote control to your camera or any number of additional cameras.
A digital zoom function so you can get even closer to the action or your friend in front
A 2.5 microphone input for external microphones
Night mode so you can record in darker and duskier conditions
Waterproof case accessory offering
External power pack accessory offering (20 hrs. record time)

 

[Tom]

Is anyone using the Contour mounted to the side of the chinbar?

I put mine right behind the visor, however this has the disadvantage that the peak of the helmet shows up in the frame. I will try later to put it on the chin-bar, my only concern is that I will get just as much of the helmet in the video-frame as when I put it higher up. And if I move it further forward on the chin-bar, at least on my helmet, it won't point straight ahead anymore.
If you are not using the strap-mount, can't you just use a flat-surface mount? When I bought mine there were two of those in the box. I even bought a couple of spare sticky-pads for them.

I was also not impressed by the windnoise recorded by the Contour. Hideous.

Hideous is a very fitting term for it indeed. Anything above 30 km/h and the audio is useless on mine. I have basically gone off it completely and won't use it again until I can do the external microphone-modification. My only problem with that is that I can't find a little microphone that will be suitable for this purpose. Anybody have any suggestions on that?

 

[johnnysneds]

I use the flat surface mount on my lid, easy to get the camera on and off and it keeps the camera stabilised better than the goggle strap mount. You would be able to use this with goggles also, just a bit of routing the goggle strap above and over the mount. I actually like seeing a bit of the peak in the video, it gives you a sense of being on a bike when your watching the video - its all personal preference though. It wouldn't take much re-adjustment to get it out of view, I believe Frank managed to achieve this.
If you have the latest firmware update on your Contour you can mess around with the sound gain to defuse the wind noise. You could also fabricate your own wee foam windscreen as the mic is located at the leading edge of the camera. I haven't had an issue with wind noise even when i had it mounted on a 1000cc at a track. Try messing around with the Contour software settings for sound.
With regards to the GPS version eating batteries. It will consume slightly more battery than the standard, however 1200mAh batteries can be bought at any phone shop for around 500Baht. I take four of them with me on long trips and can charge them up again easily off the bike (as seen in the picture). I'm going to try and modify camera to allow recording whilst being charged at the same time. At the moment as soon as you plug the mini usb cable in it wont allow it to be powered up.

 

[Tom]

...1200mAh batteries can be bought at any phone shop for around 500Baht.

Which type of battery did you buy? I had an old Nokia phone lying around, and the battery seemed to be a very near match for the one that came with the camera. The only thing was, it seemed to be about 1mm shorter, so I had to bush it down into the camera to make it work. As soon as I took my finger off, the battery didn't sit well and the camera switched off. I was thinking of buying a couple of these and glue a bit of plastic on the back end of it, but if you know of a battery that fits straight out of the box, that would be great.

I'm going to try and modify camera to allow recording whilst being charged at the same time.

If you can get that to work, you are my hero! I actually asked Contour about this before I bought the camera and got a rather vague answer which I - mistakenly, as it turned out - took to mean that it could do what you are suggesting. I would like to do the same with mine, but I'm pretty sure I'd 'brick' it if I tried... :cry

...you can mess around with the sound gain to defuse the wind noise

I tried turning down the gain already, but I still get noise when the speed picks up a bit. Is your camera the GPS-version as well? This version was actually supposed to improve the sound-quality over previous versions, which is why I went for the GPS-version rather than the regular HD-version. So far I'm not overly impressed.

 

[Tom]

...1200mAh batteries can be bought at any phone shop for around 500Baht.

Forgot to add that the batteries I could buy that fit the old phone I have were only about 900 mAh. Obviously you found something better.

 

[johnnysneds]

Hi Tom - infact I think it was a 1050mAh replacement I got from Big C hangdong. I do know someone who managed to get 12 or 1300mAh batteries from Bangkok somewhere. Ive used an old Nokia phone battery with my Contour without any problems, I think the model is BL-5C/T. Pretty sure Contour will be using these as they are cheap, slim and readily available. I haven't noticed any dimension differences between the batteries I have,but then I haven't been looking. I believe the locking mechanism for the battery is different on the newer models. I have to press my battery down quite a bit against a spring before latching the lock, so small differences in length wouldn't affect it.
My camera is an old 720p HD, so maybe the "noise" is an issue with the GPS models - too sensitive! Have you contacted Contour for some advice or searched on their forum? Im sure there must be an easy fix.

 

[Tom]

OK,

So I've just been out testing the audio settings on my ContourGPS, to see if the sound is at all usable. I played around with the microphone sensitivity, and added what we movie-moguls call a 'dead cat' (a fluffy thingie on the microphone that breaks up wind-noise). This highly professional and very expensive system (oh, alright; I stole one of my wife's hairbands again!) looked like this:

I think I'm now known in the neighborhood as The Gay Biker. Anyway, I then rode up and down the same little stretch of road 8 times, recording with the the sensitivity set to 10, 5, 3 and 1 (the max. is 50 and the factory default is 25). The exercise was then repeated with the 'dead cat' mounted. What I found was that the lower the setting, the less intrusive the wind-noise was. Big surprise, eh? However, au naturel the usable range - which I consider to be when the wind-noise is not immediately noticeable - was still only from 30 to 40 km/h. With my cutting-edge 'dead cat' mounted, it was about 50-60 km/h. Setting the sensitivity to 1 and then adding the deceased feline, gave the best result - again, big surprise, right? - but the sound gets predictably weak. If you need to increase the gain to boost it, you will also be boosting the remaining wind-noise, and then you're back to square one. I did find one sure-fire way to remove ALL wind-noise; set the sensitivity to 0. No wind-noise at all, I guarantee it. Of course, you don't get any other sound either, but you can't have everything (where would you put it?).
The conclusion, for me anyway, remains the same; without the external microphone mod, this camera is next to useless for its intended purpose (unless you don't plan on using the audio, of course). This brings me back to a question I've asked before; does anyone know where I can buy a small stereo microphone for this? I've looked around, but in the way of microphones, all I can find are 'karaoke specials', nothing useable.

 

[johnnysneds]

The problem is the peak on your helmet causing turbulence. Below is a video with my video mounted on the front fairing of a 1000cc at a race track - wind noise isn't too bad.

and here's the same camera (Contour HD) mounted on my helmet with a peak (same configuration as yours).

Ive just been out for a test ride with mine mounted on my helmet and tilted my head at different angles and it affects the wind noise drastically proving turbulence is the main contributor to wind noise on your videos. Try removing your peak and see if it makes a difference.

 

[Tom]

I had actually thought of that, but dismissed it, for two reasons:

1. The audio quality goes bad at even very low speeds, long before any turbulence from the helmet becomes significant.
2. When standing still and using the camera as handheld, even a slight (and I do mean slight!!) breeze drowns out the sound, even with the sensitivity set to 12 (remember, default was 25).

However, in the interest of science I strapped the camera to the side of my sleek, aerodynamic body over a tight-fit (why are all my shirts getting to be that way :? cotton shirt - no rustle from the fabric - and went out and tried it again. I left the sensitivity a 3, as it was in my last experiment. There was no perceptible difference. None whatsoever. It may be that your model is just better in that respect (even though the claim was that the GPS-model had improved sound over previous versions), but the fact remains that on mine the sound always has been and continues to be utterly useless. Either I get this external microphone mod sorted, or it's destined to get forgotten at the bottom of some drawer.

 

[johnnysneds]

Here's a short video of a friend using a Contour HD GPS, same model as yours, riding relatively fast. I remember setting the sound up with him and turning the gain down on the software, I can't remember to what level though.
The wind noise isn't any worse than my old one and im sure the wind noise is caused by his peak. You might have a fault with your camera.

You'll notice at the end of the video when he turns his head slightly the wind noise disappears for a second.

 

[Tom]

Sounds like he can go a bit faster than me before running into problems, but there's still a fair bit of noise on it once he picks up speed. What I'm aiming for is something like this:

 

[johnnysneds]

Nice, a massive difference, very impressed, I may give this a go with mine. It wasn't an issue before until you brought it up, now im conscious of it and need to sort it out. Have you found the jack adapter locally yet? microphone can be easily sourced on ebay, the adapter too I suppose but handier if local.

Got the "jist" from the video below, however the guy is brutal. Looks like he made the holes with a chain saw!

 

[Tom]

It wasn't an issue before until you brought it up, now im conscious of it and need to sort it out.

Terribly sorry about that... :cry Didn't mean to spoil it for you. There's another tutorial here (seems to be the 'original'):

I'll wait until I've found a proper little microphone before I start molesting my camera (I'm off to work in the not too distant future, so nothing will happen for a while). The other parts I don't foresee any problems in getting, in fact I think I might even have a female 3.5mm jack lying around somewhere. If not, I'll buy a 3.5mm extension lead and just cut the male plug off.

 

[Tom]

I'm going to try and modify camera to allow recording whilst being charged at the same time.

I've been thinking about this one a lot. It looks like it's not necessary to modify the camera in order to achieve it, according to this:

Contour car-charger

I've already tried hooking the camera up to a USB-charger - to provide power without any actual USB-data being present - but it still won't work. My guess is that if you snip off the two data-wires (should be white and green) in a USB-cable, it might just work. At any rate, I've seen this charger for USD 19, so it's not that expensive. All that remains then is to cut a small slot in the back cover to allow the USB-plug to be plugged in with the cover closed.

 

[johnnysneds]

I'm going to try and modify camera to allow recording whilst being charged at the same time.

I've been thinking about this one a lot. It looks like it's not necessary to modify the camera in order to achieve it, according to this:

Contour car-charger

I've already tried hooking the camera up to a USB-charger - to provide power without any actual USB-data being present - but it still won't work. My guess is that if you snip off the two data-wires (should be white and green) in a USB-cable, it might just work. At any rate, I've seen this charger for USD 19, so it's not that expensive. All that remains then is to cut a small slot in the back cover to allow the USB-plug to be plugged in with the cover closed.

Just snipped the data lines and it still doesn't work. I wonder why that charger allows it to run and operate at the same time!

 

[Tom]

Just snipped the data lines and it still doesn't work. I wonder why that charger allows it to run and operate at the same time!

If you have the cable opened up, you could try to connect the two data-wires on the part of the cable that comes out of the camera, looping back any signal that the camera sends out (I was actually about to sit down and do this experiment myself when I saw your post, and that was my plan B). Other than that I can only think it must be the voltage, but I wouldn't want to experiment with that. In that case I would buy the charger and either use it as is, or measure the voltage and modify as needed.

 

[johnnysneds]

Just snipped the data lines and it still doesn't work. I wonder why that charger allows it to run and operate at the same time!

If you have the cable opened up, you could try to connect the two data-wires on the part of the cable that comes out of the camera, looping back any signal that the camera sends out (I was actually about to sit down and do this experiment myself when I saw your post, and that was my plan B). Other than that I can only think it must be the voltage, but I wouldn't want to experiment with that. In that case I would buy the charger and either use it as is, or measure the voltage and modify as needed.

Camera doesn't like the data loop back - 3 warning beeps. As you mentioned has to be something to do with the way the voltage is regulated

 

[johnnysneds]

OK I think I figured out whats required. I found someone else who was having issues charging a Garmin device and operating it at the same time. Basically pin X and pin 4 inside the mini USB connector (5 pin) are connected together through a 200k resistor (standard). I tested this value on a mobile connector I had lying around (see photo below). This value is too high to operate both the charging circuit and device at the same time. According to the guy he tested his device with various values 47, 22 and 18K which worked. Unfortunately I dont have any resistors of those values lying around to try the theory out. He also mentioned success shorting pin X and 4 out. I tried this - the device continued to charge and also the red LED at the front of the device illuminated indicating it was receiving juice to the device power circuit. So more than likely the car charger will have a lower value resistor between pins 4 and X of the mini USB allowing power to the charging and device circuits.

Pin Pin
Name Description
1 +5V 5 volts DC
2 data not connected / float
3 data not connected / float
X GND connected to pin 4 (GND) with 17.3K ohm resistor
4 GND ground


I also took the Contour completely apart. I had a look at the microphone location and solder points and the external mod should be quite easily achieved. You could actually use the internal one as the external if you wanted. I seen one guy who installed the mic inside his helmet with apparently good results.