Welcome one & all

Ally

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 23, 2011
Location
Chiang Mai
Bikes
PCX - with custom valve caps
I have personally held my tongue on this subject long enough and after seeing a recent slapping down on gt-rider forum I need to say something.

Like many other people on this RideAsia forum, we have been interested in other riders experiences on other internet forums and some of us have greatly benefited from their content & reference.

Some folks have found companionship with fellow members amongst these and have been given the opportunity to release their points of view to share with others & similar to what happens in real life scenarios, they form friendships through conversations in the forums.

Some folks post to forums & don't expect anyone to reply but do expect others to read. Some folks do not post because they feel they have nothing valid to offer or experience technical shyness at creating a post with any content / images or not.

When I started riding only a couple of years ago (2007), I sought information about bikes in general, I wanted to know what other people did when they rode their bikes and so I turned to the online community that appeared to exist amongst riders in my home country of Thailand, more especially, basing itself out of northern Thailand & Chiang Mai. Wow, I thought I had found a nice place with a group of people that as time went by I might generate a sense of friendship with some of the members as I could relate with their views and their characters. gt-rider.com/thailand-motorcycle-forum seemed to be a great place to be around.

I enjoyed reading the various reports of people enjoying riding. I witnessed new members come and join in & I equally witnessed other longer term members bringing their conversations to the forum and sharing their views, it's was a place for conversation & community.

As a result of finding new information, contributing my ride reports and developing a sense of belonging, I met a few of the members of the forum during rides and the sense of community was appealing. We rode on organised charity rides or a celebratory boxing day ride. Indeed the group, community, club, team feeling grew as I met people who wanted to talk about what I had contributed to their community, as they shared similar discussions with me about their rides and people invited me for a ride and I sensed that I had joined their group.

On gt-rider forum, I would contribute my rides which were quite heavily image based. I would ride 100 - 300 km rides and post maybe a couple of paragraphs of words, some anecdotal comments about an image and share the ride report with people for them to witness what was happening during my visit, to let them see what was out there because they were not able to visit the area or simply share with others an update of what they knew of a place.

As time went by, I could see there was pissing up the wall scenarios developing and when some people posted, you would see a comment like, 'it wasn't like that when I was there before you' or 'having gone all that way, why didn't you visit that special place that only i know about' sort of thing. Oneupmanship. It also became obvious that some posters were prolific posters of content and others were just one word or one line commenters.

I was equally aware that what was 'reported' about a road trip wasn't always what happened during the ride. When a group of guys went off somewhere for a ride & stayed away from home for a couple of nights, 'what happened on the road stayed on the road' and the antics and fun which could be anything from drink, girls, boys and any other subject that a wife or family might not understand was being kept under wraps. Some who wanted to post their off road reports were challenged and some deleted and subsequently banned because of such reports.

It was at this time I became aware of a common feeling amongst trip report contributors. If I rode 200 km and took some interesting photos along the way, stopping many times to capture the scene, I wanted to share that experience with other people. Why? Because I believed it was either a trophy moment that I needed to capture & reflect on in the future or felt compelled to share it with others who might appreciate it.

So to submit contributions to an environment where what ever you contributed was subject to cynical remarks, competition and oneupmanship comparison was not easy, especially as you had ridden 200 km & stopped at all those interesting spots to share with others who might find them useful became undesirable. In 2009 I became disenchanted with the gt-rider forum for this very reason and subsequently stopped posting my ride reports. Instead of contributing my ride reports to the gt-rider forum, I blogged about them on my own website.

I would continue to look in on the forum & see other people contribute and almost tread the same ground as me, "hi I'm new to Chiang Mai, where can I … how do you…" and then witnessed the fresh blood feeling of a newcomer contributing a trip report of a route that was to many on the forum, 'so yesterday' but given new blood enthusiasm, it looked fresh and pleasing to the eye but once again dealt with by a 'been there done that' response from other members of the forum.

There was a pattern forming. New rider gets patronised & the truth of what really happens is kept out of sight.

In 2010 gtrider underwent a revamp of design to implement a new version of board software and introduced the concept of a blog to accompany the forum and advertising of businesses within the forum grew and became a dominant eye catching part of your forum visit. There was a desire to implement a poll system to raise competition between posters on the forum and it was announced that the blog would be for members to develop their contribution to be their own mini website, within the forum community.

Anyone who knows me, I am an individual free thinking person who is a bit of a techy, never far from the internet and with a camera in the other hand at the same time, will know that I have and always will help anyone with technical support of their computer, website or other online existence. When David Unkovich asked me on many occasions "what do you think…" or "How would you do…" knowing my techy background and interest in rider community environments, I believed was why I was asked and maybe of some use to the gt-rider community but after several of these such chats, I realised nothing I had to say was being used and nothing I said was given anything more than just lip service.

The commercialism grew and the content I and other members were posting was becoming more valuable to the people who run & make money from gt-rider. Peoples posting about their businesses were moderated and a number of unhappy members were banned as they aired their views or shared their interests which were considered inappropriate for the money making forum. Some members just lay silent because they were feeling out of place and the content quality on that forum from a wide range of members shrank. The heart of that community was under stress because the long in the tooth contributors, many of whom were rider associated businesses (after all how were they going to make a living) were controlled and unable to post freely.

In early 2011 I became aware of other people sharing the same feelings that I had about the forum community and met with some individuals to hear what they had to say. Almost a year later, I still see some of those folks posting on gt-rider and cannot help but wonder why.

In March 2011, Phil of RideAsia asked me if I wanted to contribute to a new forum that would be non commercial and open to anyone posting what ever they wanted without stern moderation or control. I was not keen on contributing, why should I want to after all, riding 200 km & stopping to take interesting photos was now for me a private thing and I simply put them on my website and share them with friends on Facebook. I had no interest in providing content to a group of people who might sit in their armchairs and compare my trophy with theirs.

But what I could contribute is what I offered to David Unkovich, technical support.

Cynical about how open and non commercial such a venture would be, I was keen to witness first hand if what Phil was offering the rider community would come about. Phil proved very quickly that RideAsia was going to be non commercially driven and open to free speech. After all, where was the cost ? Why would there be a need to have an income? What was the need to advertise for revenue, if the purpose of the forum was to offer the riding community a place to link with others and share their experiences.

As an aside let me just outline that hosting a forum is not expensive (2 - 3,000 thai baht a year) and the services of volunteer tech people make things happen for free. But I digress.

RideAsia is a forum that covers Asia and is developing a following for off road & track / trail rides. This is brilliant as the very existence of another community talking about bikes based in Chiang Mai (gt-rider forum) just doesn't make sense. But to have a style of rider, a type of rider, a type of ride report & conversation that is different to another local community, not only proves the need but also highlights the differences between the 2 communities.

RideAsia doesn't stop anyone advertising on it, there is no charge and the site does not generate any income directly to any provider of it's service. There are no paid advertisers and there are no paid services being provided by the forum. It is non commercial and is open to anyone to publicise their business in any way they want.

Last wednesday I joined a couple of mates on a ride to Doi Tao, starting out at Miguels & ending there in the evening. It just so happened, through no intentional planning, that some members of the gt-rider forum were gathering for a meal at the same time. Great, a chance to catch up face to face with some folks I hadn't seen for a while and reflect my respects to them for their existence as human beings. I could feel the animosity from David and others at his table but was thrilled when I had my photo taken with the rest of the riders gathered.

On return home that night, I felt compelled to share my ride with the people I rode with and considered posting to gt-rider but as my login has been disabled, I was not allowed access. I could therefore only post on RideAsia & my blog. When 24 hours later, the images taken of me at Miguels were posted on gt-rider by the brilliant photographer Jurgen Chopard, I wanted to thank him personally on that forum but could not as my account has been suspended.

So it seems there is a definite rift occurring in the riding communities that come together in the guise of people who live in Chiang Mai that ride bikes.

For the past 8 years Colin Scullion has routinely come to Thailand for the 5 winter months of his year and ridden any road and then posted about his rides on gt-rider/forum. He is a prolific poster not just about rides but bikes, food, accom, where to get & how to do stuff too.

Colin set up his style of reporting his rides almost as a direct result from conversations with David Unkovich, defining how it should be laid out and what it should contain. During 2010, Colin saw the developing RideAsia community and recognised that people wanted to do more with gps and roads & tracks that others had not reported. He spent his summer in the UK with his leg in plaster after a working accident there, migrating all his previous years rides from his website to RideAsia.

I am aware he was contacted by some folks and made to feel uncomfortable about his next seasons welcome by gt-rider community members but Colin is made of stronger stuff than to be deterred by a few threats of rejection.

This season Colin has chosen to post his ride reports to 2 forums, in order to maximise his satisfaction of sharing and also of belonging to a biking community. However, yesterday his recent post attracted a comment

View attachment 15234


After a couple of hours the 3 posts were removed but none the less, the underlying antagonism and derogatory remark from someone who sits next to David Unkovich at any opportunity is not something that should be forgotten.

I am glad that I chose to stop posting on gt-rider forum when I did. I immediately felt a sense of relief that I was not going to be adding wealth to people at my expense, their advertising income growing based upon visitors reading my contributions. But more importantly, I knew I would not need to control or censure what I said incase it was reported back to a 'friend or family that might not understand' or against the policy of the moderator. What the fuck do people think when they do something they don't want others to know, why the heck do you do it in the first place? Conversely why are the 'others' not going to 'understand' the action? Is it because the other is kept in the dark about a lot more?

Personally I am pleased that RideAsia allows any language without censorship and flares & bust ups do not get deleted or the members banned. After all, the world outside of the screen you are reading this on, is a complex and fast changing environment and people who live in controlled & censored online worlds are not enjoying the real world, let alone their life!

Ok, now I have that off my chest, I look forward to the next conversation I can contribute to in respect of Motorcycle Riders in Chiang Mai & Asia, where they ride, what they do & see & how they felt and what makes them happy & what pisses them off.

:RO
Ally
 
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Good self control Ally, 2283 words before you said fuck. I couldn't do that. :p
 
Ktm Chris said:
Well said old chap...

:RO

Ha ha! Chris, that is a point of continuing discussion amongst many people. However, I am not a 'chap' but a cow, a bitch, a sow & a hen but your would never know that would you.

:LOL

Ally
 
Well said Ally, funnily enough I bumped into David U at the Kafe today where he told me he had deleted the replies.
I asked him what Toms problem was and Unks reply was along the lines of (Phils causing him a lot of problems)
Funny that as Tom caused all the problems by himself with his e-mails insulting people.
The funny thing is this was a solo trip by myself so why bring other peoples names into it who were not on the ride
 
On a personal note, I enjoy the Captain's posts. I find them quite original. I also like dogs and really liked the picture of the dog cooling off in the water. The food pictures are not always a good thing to look at late at night after a few beers, as I find myself sneaking off towards the fridge to see what I can find.
 
Ally said:
So it seems there is a definite rift occurring in the riding communities that come together in the guise of people who live in Chiang Mai that ride bikes

The riding communities being all the ex pats out there bitching.....


This has been going on for some time........

And I'm sure you will all agree it's getting boring...
 
I too enjoy the Captains trip reports. Ive always enjoyed the comic book style of story telling rather than a thousand page epic. Call me simple but I like loads of pictures.
Keep it up Colin your doing a grand job. :DD
 
Thank you all for your compliments, I saw Auke last night and he pointed out that he really loved the picture of that dog and it seems that others appreciated it too.
I certainly wont be changing my style or losing any sleep because of one washed up old drunk on gt-rider, on top of that he never contributes anything useful at all
 
johnnysneds said:
I too enjoy the Captains trip reports. Ive always enjoyed the comic book style of story telling rather than a thousand page epic. Call me simple but I like loads of pictures.

Ditto.. And wish I could get in the habit.. But once riding all sense of stopping to capture anything goes out the window..

Let me also state for the record.. I dont think this 'what happens on tour stays on tour' ruling is such a bad thing ;)
 
Agreed, privacy is a good thing.
I would get severly pissed off if anyone posted about what I might get up to on a trip, if I was in the mood. I would not be riding with such a person again.
 
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